LA MONDA MAGAZINE ARTICLES Nº4

Throughout your life, the question of identity has been key from the very beginning: a Bosnian-Croat father and a Bosnian-Serbian mother, you were born in Bosnia, you fled the war and ended up in a refugee camp in Serbia,  before being granted political asylum in Australia at the age of 8… Can we draw a parallel between your multiple origins and your career as both a female and a male supermodel?

I definitely think that I was born into a world of conflict and transition and it has been a theme that has stayed with me for sometime. I don’t think it defines who I am, but you can definitely draw a parallel. Before the war, no-one questioned my parents’ marriage, but as soon as the war broke out, it almost seemed strange for them to be a couple because they were mixed race.  My brother and I, half Croatian, half Serbian, didn’t really fit into any Serbian, Croatian or Bosnian group. Today I don’t fit in any particular gender boundaries, at least not physically.

從一開始，身分問題一直存在你的生活裡: 波斯尼亞-克羅埃西亞父親和波斯尼亞-塞爾維亞母親，你出生在爆發戰爭的波斯尼亞,逃離了戰爭，待在塞爾維亞的難民營，直到8歲才得到澳洲政府的政治庇護...多重的原因是否造就你的男女模生涯?

我出生在一個經歷衝突和過度的時期。我不認為這會定義我是誰，但你還是可以看到一些影響。 戰爭前，我父母的婚姻關係是很正常的。 但衝突發生就變得怪怪的，因為他們是一對不同族群的伴侶。我和我哥哥，一半的克羅埃西亞，一半的塞爾維亞，無法真正融入兩個群體或是波斯尼亞裡。 就像現在，我也沒有性別上的界線，至少生理上不是。

How would you describe yourself?

I try not to describe myself, even though when I do interviews and I work with journalists it’s difficult, because they want you to summarize yourself as one thing. I find this very limiting. I would definitely describe my last few years as living between genders. You can’t say it’s one or the other.

你如何形容自己?
我盡量不用什麼詞彙來形容自己.即便是過去接受記者訪談時也是如此,但這有點困難，人們總希望你能為自己的事有個說法。我覺得這是有限的。但我能肯定形容自己在過去幾年禮，我是生活在男女之間。你不能說是在哪一邊。

How should we refer to you? He or she?

A lot of my close friends say ‘she’. But a lot of people say ‘he’ too and I am not offended by that; when you are in this position, living this life inbetween genders, you can’t be too offended by anything. Either way is fine, but I prefer “she”.

我們該怎麼稱呼你? 他或她?
我親密的朋友會使用"她"。 但是用"他"，也是可以的。當你身處在這樣的位置，活在兩個性別裡,你不能被這類的事情給激怒。兩種稱呼都可以，但我更中意"她"。

---這兩個問題，我翻得很爛。我不是很確定問題和Andrej的回答。 但這3個問題有關聯就是了---

Being a supermodel that embodies both genders, maybe you can help us with the following questions:

- What is it to be a woman?



- What is it to be a man?

Sigh. I think to be either one is to be a human being and at the end of the day, I don’t think that it’s that different to be one or the other, it’s just a part of who you are, how feminine or masculine your feelings are. Obviously there is both a physical and emotional aspect to it.

做為一個雌雄同體的超模，或許你能幫我們了解這些問題的感覺?
-做為一個女性是什麼意思?
-做為一名男性是什麼意思?

But you know how to behave as man or woman since you ‘play’ both roles, how different is being a woman from being a man for instance?

I have never been really good at playing a man! I can do it very easily for photoshoots, but it’s different from acting as a man on a daily basis. I really don’t think it is that different to be one or the other, but capitalist society does draw quite a big line that divides the genders, so these differences seem more exaggerated than they naturally are. Boys are expected to be a lot less emotional, tougher and I guess, somehow rough, where girls have a bit more freedom to express themselves physically, but less freedom mentally and  overall because we live in a patriarchal society.

但你知道如何表現個像個男人或女人，畢竟你"發揮"兩者。打個比方,有甚麼是做女性跟做男性間的不同?

我從沒成功的"做個"男人! 這點我可以在拍攝中輕鬆做到，但這跟每天每日做個男人是不同的。我真的不認為做這兩者有甚麼差異，但資本主義的社會劃出了一條很大的性別界線，才造就這些差異比他們的自然顯得更誇張些。我猜想男孩總被期望剛強點，不要那麼情緒化，這有點草率，而女孩則有更多自由可以表達情緒，但少了精神上和整體的自由，因為我們活在一個父系社會裡。

You  often hear that you have to learn to be a woman and that being a man means to be “natural”, “unsophisticated”… but isn’t it as difficult to be a man, or at least to be what is expected of a man, than to be a woman?

Yes. We are born with a gender identity, as well as a sexual orientation. Most people are not aware of their gender identity because they look in the mirror and if they are female they see a female body; they aren’t even aware. They are more aware of their sexual orientation, in other words who they find attractive. But when the physical part and the mental part don’t coincide or the match is much more complicated, that is when you become aware of gender identity. A lot of scientists  point out the fact that it is something we are born with. Of course, later on, we definitely learn how to behave in the way society dictates, but there is a biological factor to it as well. I think that men definitely have as much pressure to behave like men, as women have to behave like  women.

你經常聽到身為一個男人，要學會做個女人，意思是,"自然"、"簡單"...but isn't it as difficult to be a man, or at least to be what is expected of a man, than to be a woman?

是。我們出生時就有性別身分，還有性取向。
大多數人不會去意識自己的性別身分，因為當你照鏡子時，如果你是女性，你就會看到一個女性身體；他們甚至不會去意識到。他們也更清楚意識到自己的性取向，換句話說，他們更具吸引力。但物理部分和精神面不相吻合或匹配的層面要複雜的多了,這就是當你明確意識到性別身份時。很多科學家指出，這是我們生來就具有的。當然，然後，we definitely learn how to behave in the way society dictates, but there is a biological factor to it as well.我認為男人要表現得像個男人有很多壓力，就如女人也要表現得像個女人。

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You dress in womenswear, you wear make up… how does it feel for you? Is it a way to be truer to yourself or to ‘play’ with people?

It depends, it’s very much related to what I feel comfortable in. I didn’t wake up one day when I was a teenager thinking ‘I want to provoke people’. Bleaching my hair for instance, it was a very personal thing: I just wanted to be happy, pretty and comfortable. I was lucky throughout this process to gain a modelling career.

你穿著女裝，也化妝...這對你來說有甚麼感覺? 這是更貼近你自己還是只是在"展現"給旁人看?

視情況而定，這完全取決於我是否覺得舒適。我並不是一個10幾歲的青少年在某天起床時想著"我要怎麼引起別人的注意"。就像我染髮，這完全是個人的事情:我只想要快樂，漂亮和自在。我很幸運，因此還得到模特事業。

You have experienced war, a refugee camp, asylum… what impact has that heavy past had on you? How does it show?

I think it has made me extremely political. When I was a teenager, I was very inquisitive about life in general; I did a lot of research to find out what happened and why it happened. I wasn’t so traumatised by it, but I saw that my mother suffered the consequences; she struggled with depression and anxiety, and obviously my family has been torn apart, so I tried to find out the facts.

你經歷過戰爭、待過難民營，接受庇護...這樣的過去有對你帶來影響嗎? 又造成什麼影響?

這讓我變得有點政治。當我還是一個青少年，尋常的生活讓我感到很好奇；我做了很多研究想找出發生了什麼事又為什麼會發生。我並沒有因為這經歷而有什麼創傷，但我在我母親身上看到了影響，她在抑鬱和焦慮中掙扎，家庭又四分五裂，所以我試圖找出事實。

After being uprooted from Europe, what was your first impression when you arrived in Australia?

It was funny when we moved out from the refugee camp in Serbia; my brother and I were kids and we knew that when we moved to Australia, he would get a PlayStation and I would get my own room. I really wanted my own room! When we got there, we thought we were going to a city, because all the postcards were full of skyscrapers, but when you come to Australia it is actually mostly bushland. There are only skyscrapers in the big cities like Melbourne, but most people live in the suburbs; I remember my mum was so disappointed because she is very European, she had always lived in the city and we had to adapt to suburban life. Australian culture is so different from European culture; people are much more private. In Europe people value their terraces and their front yards, the neighbours come and have coffee with each other; whereas in Australia, people don’t venture out of their back yards, they prefer to stay confined within the privacy of their own homes. It was definitely a culture shock. You are an immigrant and no matter how multicultural Australia is, there is still a level of racism there, so we had to conform and fit in.

離開了歐洲，到了澳大利亞的第一印象是什麼?

這很有趣，當我們搬離塞爾維亞的難民營，我跟我哥知道我們要到澳大利亞，他會得到一台 PlayStation ,我會擁有自己的房間。我真的很想有自己的房間!只是當我們抵達那裡時，我們以為我們會到一個城市，因為所有明信片都充滿摩天大樓，但事實上是更多的灌木叢。摩天大樓只有在墨爾本這樣的大城市才有，大多數人是住在郊區的，我記得我媽當時很失望，因為她很歐洲，她一直都住在都市裡，我們得適應郊區的生活。
澳大利亞的文化跟歐洲文化很不同，人們更注重隱私。在歐洲，人們很看重露台和前院，因為鄰居間會在那喝著咖啡交談。而澳大利亞，人們不太會這麼做，他們傾向於保留自己家的隱私。這肯定是文化衝擊。你是個移民而不管澳大利亞的文化如何多元，種族主義仍舊存在，所以我們也得更順應和適應些。

Today, where is home for you?

It’s Melbourne, where my family is. I live in New York at the moment though.

現今，哪裡才是你的家呢?
墨爾本，我的家人在那裡。雖然我現在住在紐約。

Have you always been attracted to the fashion world? We’ve heard that for a model, your knowledge about fashion is quite impressive.

I have definitely studied the industry I’m in, I wanted to know about it and to be able to make the right decisions about my career, but I don’t think it is an industry I would have ended up in if I weren’t a model. Also, being a model wasn’t my life’s ambition; growing up with a single mother who was also an academic, we weren’t living in the best circumstances. The biggest opportunity she could give us, was to educate us; education was a way for us to go up in the world.  I was very much constrained at school, it was a bit like “if it is not a law or medical degree, don’t come home with a degree”. Modelling, acting and stuff like that wouldn’t seem sensible, it was something only people with rich parents could afford to fund.

時尚界是不是很吸引你?我聽一個模特說過，你有很豐富的時尚知識。

我確實在研究這個產業，我想在理解的情況下為我的職業生涯做決定，但我不認為這是個行業，如果我不做模特，我會把它結束掉。此外，做模特並不是我的人生志向，在ㄧ個有學術涵養的單親媽媽扶養下長大，我們並不是生活在一個最好的情況下。但她給我們很大的機會，就是教育，教育是讓我們立足世界的一種方式。學校讓我感覺有很大的侷限，有點像是"如果不是法律或醫學，就別帶其它學位回家。"模特、演戲或類似的選擇也不怎麼明智,畢竟這是你有一個有錢的父母才能負擔的起。

Was modelling a dream for you?

I think it is something everyone thinks about when they are younger.  As a child I wasn’t living the life that I felt comfortable with. Before I decided to let go and be myself, I would lay on my bed and dream about the possibilities; it wasn’t necessarily about being famous, it was more about being able to be myself. So modelling was definitely one of those things   I would think about, but at the time when I was discovered, I didn’t think that I had the physical attributes to model.

模特是否曾是你的夢想?

我想大家都認為這是只適用於還年輕時。
當我還個孩子時，我並不是活在一個我覺得舒適的狀況下。在我決定放手做我自己前，我會躺在床上夢想種種可能， 它不一定關於名氣，但一定更貼近自我。所以模特絕對是當中一個，只是在我被發掘時，我沒想過我會是physical attributes to model.

Who do you look up to? Writers, artists, models…

I am a big fan of Russian literature; I love Tolstoy, Dostoyevsky, Trotsky, Rosa Luxembourg… When it comes to my style, people like David Bowie, Boy George, Amanda Lear… My favourite model today is Kristen McMenamy.

你欣賞誰? 作家，藝術家，模特...
我是俄羅斯文學的大粉絲，我喜歡托爾斯泰、杜斯妥也夫斯基、托洛茨基、羅莎·盧森堡...
風格則是大衛鮑伊、喬治男孩、Amanda Lear...今天最愛的模特是Kristen McMenamy

How do other models react when you show up?

I like to think everyone is pretty okay with it. But it is a very competitive business; a cut throat industry where so few models can actually make a career and a living out of it. There is a lot less money in it than people think. I have definitely experienced some negativity from both sides, because I do both genders and some people think that it’s unfair. It is a bitchy industry, you can’t please everybody.

對於你的出現，其他模特有何反應?

我喜歡想成大家都覺得沒關係。但這是一個很有競爭力的行業，隨時都會被淘汰，只有少數的模特能真的能把它當成人生事業。賺的錢其實不如人們想像中的多。其實兩邊都曾讓我感到消極，因為我身兼男女模，有些人就覺得不公平。 It is a bitchy industry,你沒辦法讓每個人都高興。

What attracts you?

Confidence, humour, a kind of wild outlook on life, creativity and intelligence.

什麼會吸引你?
自信、幽默,wild outlook on life, 創造力和智慧。

What is beautiful for you?

Linda Evangelista… I think it has definitely changed. I grew up with my mum who was extremely beautiful but her standards of beauty were very high; she saw Sophia Loren and Elizabeth Taylor, those classic beauties, as ultimate beauties. I think she passed this on to me. Not that I think that beauty is so important, but it is something I’m looking at. Being in this industry, you start finding size zero beautiful too and you start taking on a more modern idea of beauty; you start to find things that are weird beautiful too. For instance, Kristen McMenamy, Gemma Ward, Saskia de Brauw… Not so much classical beauties, but there is something interesting in their look. It is interesting to see that people in a normal social situation wouldn’t be considered beautiful, but in Fashion there are no rules!

什麼才是美麗?

Linda Evangelista...我想這已經變了。
我在ㄧ個漂亮的母親身邊長大，但她的審美標準是很高的，她看到的都是些經典的美女，蘇菲婭 羅蘭和伊麗莎白 泰勒,至於最極致的美，我想她已經給我了。這並不是說美麗就是如此的重要，但這確實是我在追尋的某些東西。在這行業裡，你會追尋骨感的美也會追求現代對美的定義;但同時你也會發現一些奇異的美麗。例如，Kristen McMenamy、Gemma Ward、Saskia de Brauw...與其說是古典美，到不如說是她們有種奇異的特色。有趣的是，在社會上的觀點,人們不會認為她們美麗，但時尚圈沒有準則!

Modelling aside, what are your plans?

I don’t know. I definitely want to keep doing this for as long as I can and to try my hand at acting; I’ve just done a short film in New York. I am kind of throwing myself in at the deep end, to see if I have anything that would point me in that direction, because I don’t want to do anything I’m really shit at. I’m also promoting myself, trying to build the brand and the name to create longevity beyond just high fashion. Maybe I’ll go back to school, who knows? Or I’ll end up on a farm.

除了模特，還有什麼其它規劃?

我不知道。但我肯定會讓它繼續長遠下去，也會嘗試演戲,我剛在紐約完成一部短片。我是那種會把自己扔進深水裡，然後看看自己還有甚麼方向可走的人，我不想甚麼都沒做,就這樣錯過機會。我當然也會打造自己，創立品牌,建立更長遠的名聲，而不只是走走時裝秀而已。
也可能我會回去求學，誰知道呢? 搞不好我會在農場過完一生。

We’ve heard about a reality show.

We’ve been trying to push that option for a while now and at the moment they are considering it in Europe  . I will only do it if it fits with my personality, I would not like to become that crazy person on TV.

我們都聽說有關實鏡秀的消息。

我們嘗試進行這個一段時間了，只是現在再考慮要不要在歐洲。
如果這適合我的個性，我就會做,我可不想成為電視上那種行為瘋狂的人。

---這段完全不知道要怎麼翻...---

“Artistic expression as a way of…

…questioning the world and exposing the truth about life.”

"用藝術表現呈現...
...質疑世界和揭露人生真相。"

 

Interview: Guillaume Thomas

 

來源 http://www.lamondamagazine.com/m/ataque/andrej-pejic/


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這篇有兩種語言，一個是西班牙文，一個是英文。
懂英文的人，我建議可以直接看原文,這篇詞彙沒有那麼艱深。

----11.13✍
我翻譯完了!  但我得收回詞彙沒那麼艱深這句話，至少對我來說是這樣的。雖然看得懂單字，但放在一起，就不懂意思是什麼了(笑)
然後我猜這篇是今年7月之後接受的採訪。
這篇的前半段，採訪者提到Andrej小時候的經歷，可以去看一下這篇The Australian Women’s Weekly April 2013
裡面有更多當時情況的描述。

每次看到採訪者問她有沒有其它規劃，

我總會這麼想，Andrej在這產業裡已經是則傳奇了。 或許有一天，有位模特出現，然後人們會想, ...喔,他/她 讓我想到Andrej Pejic。
可能是外型、感覺或是雌雄同體的特質。然後人們就會想到Andrej。
哈哈，我真的會這樣想像,甚至覺得真的有這個可能。